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ZSNES 1.51 Released! 
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FitzRoy wrote:
And how about these emulators with the "Machine" in the menu. An emulator is not a machine.

It is.

FitzRoy wrote:
There are processes that can and should be simplified. It's just silly to have to turn on "the machine" after loading a rom.

True.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 7:50 am
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FitzRoy wrote:
Just look at the two biggest sega emulators with their annoying RF signal bullshit. The gaming experience just wouldn't be complete without emulating the most notoriously annoying tv signal, would it?


Are you talking about the TV static? I dunno man, I kinda like that. :p

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 9:29 am
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FitzRoy wrote:
And it's very, very rare that the garbage will actually prove annoying during gameplay


Considering that annoyance is purely a matter of opinion, you dictating that garbage annoying people being "rare' as if it were a fact is ludicrous. Who died and made you God?

I also concur with blackmyst's post about the sega emulator static.


Fri Jan 26, 2007 10:09 am
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Well, I really like the NTSC video filter from blargg. It's kind of limited though (not the filter's fault), as you have to run at exactly 60fps to get the full effect. This either requires bullshitting clock speeds (bad for accuracy), or resampling audio. It's impossible to run a monitor at ~60.09fps/~59.97fps/~50fps and audio at ~32040hz, so one of them has to give somewhere :(


Fri Jan 26, 2007 5:17 pm
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Metatron wrote:
FitzRoy wrote:
And it's very, very rare that the garbage will actually prove annoying during gameplay


Considering that annoyance is purely a matter of opinion, you dictating that garbage annoying people being "rare' as if it were a fact is ludicrous. Who died and made you God?


Yes, it's true that it never bothered me personally, but I also wouldn't ask for a specialized option if it did. Personally, I think it's funny that we get more dumb feature requests like this than bug reports when Chrono trigger was flickering black on every single menu popup. I would bet that these people who are so obsessed with getting their emulator to act like their old tv are the same people who can't live without savestates. Selective nostalgia at its best.

Metatron wrote:
I also concur with blackmyst's post about the sega emulator static.


Even funnier is the fact that many people never used RF for their consoles, but used composite. And we know that composite/video mode on most tvs shows nothing. Kega Fusion has the static on both, and removes the annoying sound that goes with the static. Even the emus that use the "machine" don't keep the rom loaded when I close and reopen the emulator. A real cartridge would stay in until I removed it. The game video should also appear as it would on an RF hooked up game, but the emulator defaults to go digital afterwards, making for an very un-nostalgic transition.

An emulator is not a machine. It's a program in machine language. It doesn't load cartridges. It loads ROM images derived from cartridges or created from scratch. The only time that static should show up is if you've got some kind of RF filter enabled. You want to remove garbage? Hack the rom. Adjust your monitor's display. Buy a tv with overscan and output to it. There are better options than adding to the already confusing plethora of options to appease a vocal minority.


Fri Jan 26, 2007 5:28 pm
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FitzRoy wrote:
You want to remove garbage? Hack the rom. Adjust your monitor's display. Buy a tv with overscan and output to it. There are better options than adding to the already confusing plethora of options to appease a vocal minority.

Now that's a statement that I totally agree with.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:04 pm
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You do realize in the end that the developers are ones to accept or reject feature requests in the end. Whether you agree with that or not is another issue altogether.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:23 pm
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Yes, but it seems like there isn't enough discourse on this stuff. It just gets requested and happens, falling through the cracks as another "neat feature." Not everything that's nostalgic makes sense. Hopefully it gets across in my posts that there's a way for an author to consider the worth and sensibility of something before adding it. That video noise and pincushion stuff is a fairly recent development, IIRC. Sometimes I think it gets to the point that everything feature-wise gets done, and even the authors start to feel that their program is stagnating. Either that, or people get older and don't enjoy games like they used to, and start wanting to add this stuff out of desperation.


Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:37 pm
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EMu-LoRd wrote:
- 2xSai, Super 2xSai, Super Eagle and Interpolation prevent the last line from showing (although Interpolation shows it a little).


Interpolation doesn't really need fixing, but the 2xSaI filters are fixed now.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:39 pm
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Jipcy wrote:
Quick question: Is there a reason why BMP is the default screenshot output format? Shouldn't it be PNG (for space-saving reasons)?


Ok, I've changed the default behavior now. PNG is used by default unless you are using the DOS port or disabled PNG support when compiling.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:55 pm
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Deathlike2 wrote:
Jipcy wrote:
Quick question: Is there a reason why BMP is the default screenshot output format? Shouldn't it be PNG (for space-saving reasons)?
Ok, I've changed the default behavior now. PNG is used by default unless you are using the DOS port or disabled PNG support when compiling.

Sweet.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 7:20 pm
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Deathlike2 wrote:
EMu-LoRd wrote:
- 2xSai, Super 2xSai, Super Eagle and Interpolation prevent the last line from showing (although Interpolation shows it a little).


Interpolation doesn't really need fixing, but the 2xSaI filters are fixed now.

Great! It works now. Although the right side of the screen creates garbage (i.e. try Top Gear 3000 intro with the stars flying towards the screen). This only happens when one of the 2xSai filters are enabled.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 7:45 pm
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EMu-LoRd wrote:
Deathlike2 wrote:
EMu-LoRd wrote:
- 2xSai, Super 2xSai, Super Eagle and Interpolation prevent the last line from showing (although Interpolation shows it a little).


Interpolation doesn't really need fixing, but the 2xSaI filters are fixed now.

Great! It works now. Although the right side of the screen creates garbage (i.e. try Top Gear 3000 intro with the stars flying towards the screen). This only happens when one of the 2xSai filters are enabled.


I can't say I've figured out what causes that. The filter doesn't seem to properly update (on any consistant basis) on the rightmost edge.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 7:52 pm
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Deathlike2 wrote:
EMu-LoRd wrote:
Deathlike2 wrote:
EMu-LoRd wrote:
- 2xSai, Super 2xSai, Super Eagle and Interpolation prevent the last line from showing (although Interpolation shows it a little).


Interpolation doesn't really need fixing, but the 2xSaI filters are fixed now.

Great! It works now. Although the right side of the screen creates garbage (i.e. try Top Gear 3000 intro with the stars flying towards the screen). This only happens when one of the 2xSai filters are enabled.


I can't say I've figured out what causes that. The filter doesn't seem to properly update (on any consistant basis) on the rightmost edge.

With old graphics mode, the bottom line has 'garbage' as well. I know for a fact that other emulators that use 2xSai mode, don't suffer from this issue. Could this be some sort of offset problem? You can see clearly that the screen is moved up and left just by 1 pixel of some kind.

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Fri Jan 26, 2007 7:53 pm
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FitzRoy wrote:
Metatron wrote:
FitzRoy wrote:
And it's very, very rare that the garbage will actually prove annoying during gameplay


Considering that annoyance is purely a matter of opinion, you dictating that garbage annoying people being "rare' as if it were a fact is ludicrous. Who died and made you God?


Yes, it's true that it never bothered me personally, but I also wouldn't ask for a specialized option if it did. Personally, I think it's funny that we get more dumb feature requests like this than bug reports when Chrono trigger was flickering black on every single menu popup. I would bet that these people who are so obsessed with getting their emulator to act like their old tv are the same people who can't live without savestates. Selective nostalgia at its best.


Pffft. What's your point? That we ought to repeat the same known bugs for Chrono Trigger over and over? The devs likely know about that already most likely, and it does no one a service to file more than one bug report to begin with. More often than not a bug report is a repeat.

Also, kindly stop making an ass out of yourself with your idiotic assumptions about everybody who disagrees with your bullheaded stupidity. I have absolutely no intention of making ZSNES look like my TV, otherwise I wouldn't use HQ2x. I simply find a solid-color or garbage line that looks distinctly out of place distracting when it happens. If you don't, good for you, but it's worth noticing that while I am making a peaceful request, you on the other hand are taking the torch to anyone making that request like a zealot over a potential OPTION. It's a piece of software. Lighten up.

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Metatron wrote:
I also concur with blackmyst's post about the sega emulator static.


Even funnier is the fact that many people never used RF for their consoles, but used composite. And we know that composite/video mode on most tvs shows nothing. Kega Fusion has the static on both, and removes the annoying sound that goes with the static. Even the emus that use the "machine" don't keep the rom loaded when I close and reopen the emulator. A real cartridge would stay in until I removed it. The game video should also appear as it would on an RF hooked up game, but the emulator defaults to go digital afterwards, making for an very un-nostalgic transition.


I'm trying to figure out why I should care about this, seeing as how in my case liking the static effect has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that it's an RF signal; I simply like how it looks. If this is a problem, kindly stuff it because I don't care about what you think about my preferences in this instance. Can you kindly stop your idiotic crusade now?


Fri Jan 26, 2007 10:04 pm
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Metatron wrote:
Pffft. What's your point? That we ought to repeat the same known bugs for Chrono Trigger over and over? The devs likely know about that already most likely, and it does no one a service to file more than one bug report to begin with. More often than not a bug report is a repeat.


So what are these mystery games with the terrible, horrible defects you're talking about? We already established that the blue SMW line was a zsnes bug, not the real output.

Metatron wrote:
I am making a peaceful request, you on the other hand are taking the torch to anyone making that request like a zealot over a potential OPTION. It's a piece of software. Lighten up.


What's better, fixing the line, or removing it altogether? Is the English language too serious for you? Where are you getting this aura of zeal in my posts? Do you need a nap or something?

Metatron wrote:
I'm trying to figure out why I should care about this, seeing as how in my case liking the static effect has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that it's an RF signal; I simply like how it looks. If this is a problem, kindly stuff it because I don't care about what you think about my preferences in this instance. Can you kindly stop your idiotic crusade now?


That's a great argument, Metatron. So if every person requested a different silly animation in the background, they should each be implemented so long as they're optional? Can you not see the basic problem with that?

And hopefully, you caught that part of my criticism on the static was the fact that it was not an option, but default and permanent in several of the best emulators. Besides, as I was talking about it, I am obviously criticizing it on the basis of why it was added in the first place (nostalgia), not because random crackheads like you thought it looked pretty.


Fri Jan 26, 2007 10:28 pm
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Just shut up, stop hijacking our release thread with your ranting.


Fri Jan 26, 2007 11:27 pm
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Ok, I've addressed the 2xSaI filters issue in SVN. The thing about the filter is that it doesn't quite modify the last vertical line, so that has to be hidden. On the other hand, I don't know why the data near the rightmost edge seem to cause problems with the filter... so that portion is clean/cleared up a bit. It should work across all games.

Edit: Never mind, pf said it was intentional. So, it seems to work just fine then... DOS port does need more testing unfortunately...

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Last edited by Deathlike2 on Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:23 am, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Jan 27, 2007 1:23 am
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Great release, but LOL!...You guys must really hate Axelay. I seem to spot a new bug with it in every release. Noticing garbage on the second stage appearing on the sides of the screen as you approach the boss. I'm not bitching, just laughing about it, thats all. No point in bugging you guys about it . It'll get fixed with time, I guess.


Sat Jan 27, 2007 2:29 am
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denzilla wrote:
Great release, but LOL!...You guys must really hate Axelay. I seem to spot a new bug with it in every release. Noticing garbage on the second stage appearing on the sides of the screen as you approach the boss. I'm not bitching, just laughing about it, thats all. No point in bugging you guys about it . It'll get fixed with time, I guess.


Timing most likely is the issue.

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Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:22 am
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FitzRoy wrote:
Metatron wrote:
Metatron wrote:
I am making a peaceful request, you on the other hand are taking the torch to anyone making that request like a zealot over a potential OPTION. It's a piece of software. Lighten up.


What's better, fixing the line, or removing it altogether? Is the English language too serious for you? Where are you getting this aura of zeal in my posts? Do you need a nap or something?


no one suggested removing it all together.

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Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:44 am
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Context = Removing it from sight. Blocking it out. Enough.

franpa wrote:
if such a thing was added to zsnes id remove the last line...


Sat Jan 27, 2007 5:48 am
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but it can easily be brought back via the options... thus it is not removed all together.

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Sat Jan 27, 2007 6:19 am
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Deathlike2 wrote:
Edit: Never mind, pf said it was intentional. So, it seems to work just fine then... DOS port does need more testing unfortunately...

So the garbage on the right and bottom side is intentional? Please explain :?

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Sat Jan 27, 2007 10:02 am
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EMu-LoRd wrote:
So the garbage on the right and bottom side is intentional? Please explain :?


"It's a feature, not a bug" :P

(sorry, couldn't resist)


Sat Jan 27, 2007 10:14 am
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