zsnes stretch full screen

[Reznor007]

The black bars are visible though. I've used TV out on my 9600 and I still see the bars. A PC monitor and TV are the same aspect ratio

Only cause the freakin' card still chooses to shrink the f*&#%^ video output, so that you can see EVERYTHING... I HATE PC-to-TV adapters that don't appreciate the power of overscan. x.x

The "power" of overscan? It's a bad thing really. Although the card has an overscan option if you want to lose some of your output.

Note, that overscan DOES NOT change the aspect ratio.

[BanonX]

My video card (GeForce FX5900) let's me enlarge or shrink the overall image but it doesn't let me "squeeze" the vertical and horzontal the way I want it to.. If it did, everything would be fine..

I can't be sure but I think just by using TV out at all, I'm getting a more horizontally stretched image on my TV.. It happens with video too..
If I play a movie on DivX player on 16:9 ratio, it is more squished on my TV than on my monitor.. I have to compensate by going to 16:10 on the DivX player to make it fill up the entire TV screen..

So yes, I would agree that ideally full screen PC should equal full screen TV but in my case it just doesn't.. I have black above and below.

[Reznor007]

It could just be that your TV is slipping out of alignment. My parents have an older TV that used to be fine, but is now slightly stretched vertically. It may just be some other setting on your PC though.

Unless you have a widescreen TV/monitor, they should both be 4:3 .

[-_pentium5.1_-]

Nobody seems to have really mentioned this: Darkfalz's aspect ratio code is a step behind the current state of the art - it's basically what SNES9x did in versions 1.40 through 1.41-1. What SNES9x does in versions 1.42 and later is currently held to be correct. In the SNES's 224/448 vertical-resolution modes, the black bar (with respect to the SNES's addressable scanlines) is entirely at the bottom of the screen. I'm pretty sure that an additional black bar does exist at the top of the screen on a real SNES because not all of the NTSC or PAL scanlines are used.

I know this isn't really the issue at hand, but this was the most convenient place to mention this fact.

[Hitokage]

and I think what you are forgetting is that although darkfalzs aspect ratio looks odd on a PC monitor (where the top and bottom black is visible) on a TV it is not visible. Which is the point he has been trying to make all this time. If you stretch the perspective vertically until those black bars disappear, it would look identical to a real SNES display on a TV screen..
Problem is that I can't make my video card do that...

I don't understand the point in producing an aspect that's wrong when put on a screen. S mode simply does not produce the correct aspect, even on my TV. There should be an S+R combo mode which would fill an ENTIRE 640x480 window as much as possible while retaining correct aspect.

[snkcube]

Wow, bringing back an old thread. Nice.

[Hitokage]

Good god, the thread moved from the middle of page 1 to the top!

[MaxSt]

...while retaining correct aspect.

which is, in you opinion, equals _____ ?

[Nightcrawler]

Obviously no one in this topic has heard of TVTool.

Everyone quit bitching and just go get TVTool!

It will let you customize your TVout like never before! You can make it whatever aspect ratio you want and whatever overscan you want.

I've been having full screen TV out to my customization for years now using TVTool.

I apologize if I made this post already. I swear to god(if there is one) I typed it all up earlier today. I must have not hit submit and closed the browser window or something because I couldn't find my post.

[JFD62780]

Ummm, Nightcrawler, what about us ATI card users? I found that TVTool's mainly for nVidia users only, according to the downloads page. It mentioned Ge-force and not Radeon.

[Reznor007]

...while retaining correct aspect.

which is, in you opinion, equals _____ ?

4:3, simple question

[grinvader]

...while retaining correct aspect.

which is, in you opinion, equals _____ ?

4:3, simple question

Your TV screen is 4:3. Now tell me that SNES games took the full height of it without missing anything on the left/right (i.e. overscan).

[Nightcrawler]

Ummm, Nightcrawler, what about us ATI card users? I found that TVTool's mainly for nVidia users only, according to the downloads page. It mentioned Ge-force and not Radeon.

You are absolutely right. I forgot about that. It does only work for Nvidia cards. I guess you are shit out of luck then! Continue bitching! You'll have to come over and use perfect TV out at my house.

[Reznor007]

...while retaining correct aspect.

which is, in you opinion, equals _____ ?

4:3, simple question

Your TV screen is 4:3. Now tell me that SNES games took the full height of it without missing anything on the left/right (i.e. overscan).

Yes, they fill the full height of the TV. A TV naturally stretches everything it receives to 4:3.

I've had a SNES since they launched in the US so I have decent experience with the real thing.

[grinvader]

Yes, they fill the full height of the TV. A TV naturally stretches everything it receives to 4:3.

I know that it fills height. I was asking you to check if it filled height without overscanning anything left or right (which would mean a 4:3 pic).

Check carefully.

[MaxSt]

...while retaining correct aspect.

which is, in you opinion, equals _____ ?

4:3, simple question

Any "S" mode gives you 4:3. Why you need some weird "S+R combo mode"?

[Reznor007]

...while retaining correct aspect.

which is, in you opinion, equals _____ ?

4:3, simple question

Any "S" mode gives you 4:3. Why you need some weird "S+R combo mode"?

Compare MAME's aspect correction (running one of the Nintendo Super System games) to ZSNES. Did you see the shots I linked here a while back? MAME matches my real SNES while ZSNES is stretched.

[MaxSt]

Compare MAME's aspect correction (running one of the Nintendo Super System games) to ZSNES. Did you see the shots I linked here a while back? MAME matches my real SNES while ZSNES is stretched.

I like numbers, hard numbers. For example, 640/480 = 4/3 = 1.33 is such a hard number.

Your screenshots of real SNES gives me 1.29.
Your screenshots of ZSNES are too old, I fixed some code since then, so S modes are really fullscreen again, and aspect is 1.33.

I think the closest one is 800x600 DR FULL with HQ3X enabled - 1.28
This particular mode is not really DR, but something between DR and DS.

MaxSt.

[Reznor007]

Compare MAME's aspect correction (running one of the Nintendo Super System games) to ZSNES. Did you see the shots I linked here a while back? MAME matches my real SNES while ZSNES is stretched.

I like numbers, hard numbers. For example, 640/480 = 4/3 = 1.33 is such a hard number.

Your screenshots of real SNES gives me 1.29.
Your screenshots of ZSNES are too old, I fixed some code since then, so S modes are really fullscreen again, and aspect is 1.33.

I think the closest one is 800x600 DR FULL with HQ3X enabled - 1.28
This particular mode is not really DR, but something between DR and DS.

MaxSt.

How did you get 1.29 for the real SNES shots? You have to remember that it was captured via analog, so counting the pixels won't be exactly accurate.

And yes, since you removed Darkfalz's code the aspect is now much more accurate. It is slightly off though, as ZSNES is skipping the last(or was it first?) scanline. It's only outputting 256x223.

[MaxSt]

How did you get 1.29 for the real SNES shots? You have to remember that it was captured via analog, so counting the pixels won't be exactly accurate.

Can you propose some other method?

Because if we can't derive the accurate number from these real SNES shots, thet they are kinda useless, don't you think?

MaxSt.

[Reznor007]

How did you get 1.29 for the real SNES shots? You have to remember that it was captured via analog, so counting the pixels won't be exactly accurate.

Can you propose some other method?

Because if we can't derive the accurate number from these real SNES shots, thet they are kinda useless, don't you think?

MaxSt.

What I mean is you can't find the exact 256x224 pixels in an analog image. The aspect ratio is definitely 4:3 though.

[Mark7]

Well, the picture size will differ on each tv. Each tv will have a slighty different visible screen.

Anyway, I'm sure that Zsnes shouldn't resize from 224 to 480, but from 224 to 448. That way each snes line will match a line on your tv and the picture will be a lot sharper than a 224 to 480 resize.
If you then use tv-out at 640*480 with overscan, i think it should be fairly close to the original...

[MaxSt]

That way each snes line will match a line on your tv and the picture will be a lot sharper than a 224 to 480 resize.

Not a lot sharper. Just a little bit sharper.

[Reznor007]

Well, the picture size will differ on each tv. Each tv will have a slighty different visible screen.

Anyway, I'm sure that Zsnes shouldn't resize from 224 to 480, but from 224 to 448. That way each snes line will match a line on your tv and the picture will be a lot sharper than a 224 to 480 resize.
If you then use tv-out at 640*480 with overscan, i think it should be fairly close to the original...

That's what Darkfalz's code did basically. It makes the games look too fat(wide).

[cdbsi]

The "power" of overscan? It's a bad thing really.

I disagree. It is not necessarily a bad thing. As a lot of stuff that is made for tv is made with overscan in mind.