16:9 Viewing Causing Image Stretching

[Dathu]

I swear I looked through the threads. I didn't see anything that addressed this issue directly.

Both my television and monitor are 1920x1080. No matter what resolution I set it at, it either keeps a 8:7 ratio and doesn't fill my screen (Custom DR F set at 1920x1080), or fills my screen but is stretched (Custom DS F set at 1920X1080). I've played with all the resolutions available and yielded no favorable results. The only setting that gives me proper ratio is the 1024x896 DR W. I can keep that window size in full mode if I do Custom DR F set at 1920c1080 and set my Video Filter-HQ Filter at 4x, but it still doesn't fill my screen. I'm not expecting true 1080p, I'd just like a way to view true 8:7 ration as magnified as possible.

I apologize if I ended my search prematurely and this topic has already been discussed, but any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Deathlike2]

This has been discussed to death (search is your friend), but here's a quick breakdown.

8:7 is the internal resolution ratio, but the outputted resolution is for a 4:3 TV (yes, ages before hi-def).

R is ratio.. it is a limited stretch as intended for OLD computers where stretching causes performance issues.

S is stretch, that is what you're looking for...

IIRC, Keep 4:3 ratio is enabled in the video controls. If you want pure stretch... just disable it for the custom res you're specifying.

[Dathu]

That's the problem. The legend at the bottom indicated the meaning of R and S, but whenever I choose a full screen mode that has R (*any resolution* DR F), my playing screen (surrounded by black so I know I'm in full screen mode) is still much smaller that my monitor. In fact, it is exactly 1024X896. I could use my custom settings and just use an S setting, but then it's stretched. Not completely mind you: vertically yes, but horizontally no. And it's very noticeable on some titles where perfect circles are common elements. Does this mean that 8:7 can't be achieved in full screen? I am wondering because there is a bit of a difference between 8:7 and 4:3: 12.5% actually. Is the "Custom 1920x1080 DS F" setting actually giving me its 4:3 ratio? If so, then what I think is stretched is actually 4:3, and what I think is proper ratio, 8:7, is some odd "internal ratio." But if 4:3 is the ratio that is intended, why do perfect circles look stretched? All I need is a square that fills the center of my screen.

Before replying I tried searching for more threads on this, but after using search words such as 4:3, 8:7, ratio, stretched, and full screen, I came up with nothing. Would you, or anyone else kind enough, happen to have links to the older threads. I'm sorry if I'm confusing you, or if I seem frustratingly dense. I'd really like to figure this out since this is my favorite emulator and I really want to plat it on my new TV.

[Deathlike2]

My suggestion is that you edit zsnesw.cfg and change Keep4_3Ratio to disabled if you want that stretch to fill the desired resolution regardless of the intended 4:3 ratio.

Edit: I'm pretty sure such threads existed... possibly a board/database cleanup had occured since then.... but the point was that the intended ratio is 4:3 for a TV. The "internal" resolution is what the console does. Some games take stretching into account, where others might not. A pixel on a 4:3 TV screen is not square...

Also, there are some games that have black borders put in intentionally... (usually to render less stuff). Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy 6 come to mind as examples.

By default, Keep4_3Ratio is enabled.

[Dathu]

The first game I tried was Zelda, and I immediately noticed Link had gained a few pounds. lol

I'm afraid altering configurations is a little beyond me. I guess I'll just have to get used to a small screen within my screen.

Thank you for replying despite the annoying repetitiveness of my problem.

[Agozer]

I'm afraid altering configurations is a little beyond me. I guess I'll just have to get used to a small screen within my screen.

Open Zsnesw.cfg in Notepad, for example and seach for the line Keep4_3Ratio = . Set it to 0 or 1 (disabled or enabled) depending on your preferences and then save the changes.

[Deathlike2]

If/when you are using a scaled non-4:3 ratio resolution, the filter tab shows another option to enable/disable the feature I spoke of earlier.

[Dathu]

lol Okay, took me a while. First I couldn't find the cfg file, then when I did, changing it did nothing. So I then opened the application directly (rather than through the shortcut) and it created the cfg (rather than the virtual one I found through search), but it wouldn't let me modify it. I then figured out that I could modified it by saving it in a different folder. Then I deleted the old one, and moved the new one in to replace it, and BINGO!

I now have that 4:3 option in the filters tab. Unfortunately it's not having the desired affect. Originally, in "DS F", I was getting 62.5% (?:?), after activating 4:3 option, I am getting 4:3 (75%), which is better, but what I want, or what looks the most in balance, is 8:7 (87.5%). The only way I can get this is, when in full mode (DR F), by activating the HQ Filter under the Filters tab and setting it to "4x" which only gives me a 1024X896 8:7 image. If I activate HQ Filter in "DS F" it just stretches it the whole of my screen. Ovals everywhere!

Is it because I'm on Windows 7? I tried running it as XP in that whole "compatibility tab" thing, but it had no affect.

Thank you both for being so patient with me.

[Deathlike2]

For the sake of clarity... what game are you testing this on? If the 4:3 option is disabled, DS F should stretch regardless of the ratio. As I've said before, some games have actual black borders built into them.

The HQx filters don't change this either way IIRC.

My other alternative suggestion.. use a Windowed mode instead of a Fullscreen mode. You can still get the same effect as fullscreen but it may change what you are seeing.

By the way, what video card are you using? You hadn't mentioned it at all.

[blackmyst]

Not this again. Dathu, have you ever even played a console? Have you ever seen one that displayed its graphics in some tiny square in the middle of the screen?

Consoles work on TV's. Their graphics go on a TV screen. TV screens (at least the ones from the era we're talking about) are 4:3. Games are made for consoles. Games are made for 4:3. Every other argument you can possibly think of is irrelevant. Like:

But if 4:3 is the ratio that is intended, why do perfect circles look stretched?

Developer laziness, or technical convenience. If you bother looking for them, there's countless examples where circles are in fact modified to meet the proper ratio (i.e. they look "thin" in 8:7).

The first game I tried was Zelda, and I immediately noticed Link had gained a few pounds. lol

That's only because you're used to seeing the wrong thing, you're used to seeing an anorexic Link.

Again, none of that matters. A SNES console display fits a 4:3 TV, the end. I can't fathom why oh why some people keep stubbornly insisting they should be playing in some square box, as if anyone would make a console that displays graphics like that. It's just so weird I can't wrap my head around it. Why?

[Deathlike2]

There's a Sega Genesis reference to made somewhere... despite it not being relevant to the discussion.

[paulguy]

Not this again. Dathu, have you ever even played a console? Have you ever seen one that displayed its graphics in some tiny square in the middle of the screen?

Consoles work on TV's. Their graphics go on a TV screen. TV screens (at least the ones from the era we're talking about) are 4:3. Games are made for consoles. Games are made for 4:3. Every other argument you can possibly think of is irrelevant. Like:

But if 4:3 is the ratio that is intended, why do perfect circles look stretched?

Developer laziness, or technical convenience. If you bother looking for them, there's countless examples where circles are in fact modified to meet the proper ratio (i.e. they look "thin" in 8:7).

The first game I tried was Zelda, and I immediately noticed Link had gained a few pounds. lol

That's only because you're used to seeing the wrong thing, you're used to seeing an anorexic Link.

Again, none of that matters. A SNES console display fits a 4:3 TV, the end. I can't fathom why oh why some people keep stubbornly insisting they should be playing in some square box, as if anyone would make a console that displays graphics like that. It's just so weird I can't wrap my head around it. Why?

Oh god this, 100x this. Stretched video drives me nuts, from using the wrong aspect in emulators to people having the zoom/stretch/picture/aspect mode on their widescreen TV wrong (Especially in office waiting areas and stuff!). I'll never understand how people can prefer that crap. I honestly think some people don't even notice when everyone looks like they're an extra 50-100 heavier because their TV is set wrong.

[Dathu]

lol Mysty is totally right!

At first I ran through quite a few titles (Zelda, Mario, Bust-a-Move, Mana), all in that weird and mysterious 62.5% ratio, and everything was ovals. But when I did the cfg-ering, the first and only title I tried was Zelda. But after trying Busta, I see what he means by "anorexic." In Busta 4:3 does make perfect circles, which is awesome (love that game), but in Zelda the trees are still wide ovals (as well as medallions, symbols, and anything else that should be a perfect circle) . So I guess it's like he said:

Developer laziness, or technical convenience.

For why some games make perfect circles in 4:3 and some don't. Although I'm happy to know it's the games and not me, I still really wish there was a way to choose if you want to play a full screen game in 4:3 or 8:7 so that way you could always have a perfect circle regardless of how lazy the developers are. In fact, Perfect Circles for Everyone! lol

Oh and yes Mysty, I have played a console on a tube television. I go as far back as Atari. Dig Dug all the way!

It probably doesn't matter now, but I'm using a Nvidia 7200.

Thank you guys so much for your help.

[blackmyst]

Zelda's trees are supposed to look like ovals, just look at Link's Awakening on the GB, where there's no pixel stretching at all. The medallions might not be perfect circles because it's not as easy to correct for ratio and still have the circle look smooth for a small sprite like that. So in 8:7, you have your round medallions, but the rest of the game is wrong.

Never is what you're looking at in 4:3 not precisely what anyone else playing the snes would have been looking at, so aside from the odd round sprite, why would any developer ever create their game any other way? We've had like a dozen boneheads in here who can't seem to grasp this simple concept for whatever reason, even after several attempts to explain it. Seems like you get it though, but I think you're still a bit too hung up on the circles.

Oh and it was a rhetorical question, btw.

[Gil_Hamilton]

And some games won't be right in either mode, as some elements will be corrected and some won't.

[alyxx]

On my monitor, which is a BenQ Senseye 3, I can use the monitor's menu system to set it to NOT stretch a 4:3 image. That way I can enjoy SNES games in their original ratio if I just set the emulator to a 4:3 resolution.

Though I honestly don't mind playing my games stretched into widescreen mode. In some games it looks nicer.

[jantyego]

it seems no one understands the problem

no one wants to play with for example mario bros. 3 in 16:9 fullscreen... no... but we want the 1024*896 (good old 8:7 res 4x hq filter) stretch to 1234*1080
but zsnes fucks up the longer side to 14xx (I dont remember)

that is the "big" question what cant be answered for 6 years in this forum and I do believe its about 10 minutes to fix but no one understands its and everybody's joking about it

sad

[paulguy]

Just click use 4:3 ratio, jesus.

[adventure_of_link]

and you didn't have to cross-post this into another thread, jesus.

[sweener2001]

it seems no one understands the problem

no one wants to play with for example mario bros. 3 in 16:9 fullscreen... no... but we want the 1024*896 (good old 8:7 res 4x hq filter) stretch to 1234*1080
but zsnes fucks up the longer side to 14xx (I dont remember)

that is the "big" question what cant be answered for 6 years in this forum and I do believe its about 10 minutes to fix but no one understands its and everybody's joking about it

sad

hahahahhahahhahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahh....

that was good.

[paulguy]

ok.. click.. where? do you understand my problem?

Reply in the thread. If you have the problem, there's probably someone else who has the problem and could look here to find the solution.



You have to be in "Variable" or "Custom" mode for it to show up, I imagine.

And you don't need to point out the palette issue, I don't know why that happened.

And instead of being a dick about it, why not try solving the problem first, rather than acting like it's everyone else's fault?

[jantyego]

which zsnes version is that?

[jantyego]

lol

and you think the problem solved like that, mr. copperfield?
dont you see the distorsion?

[paulguy]

1.51 Linux version. Everything should be more or less the same as far as I know except for the opengl stuff. Use 4:3 ratio should be in the same place in the Windows version, if you're using a custom mode.

EDIT:
Yeah there isn't much you can do about that with zsnes. I can turn on bilinear filtering in the linux version, but in Windows, you can't specify scaling mode for directdraw. Wait for zsnes 2.0 or use something else. Don't act like everyone's at fault when you didn't explain the problem the first time.

[jantyego]

btw I dont want 4:3 I want to keep the ratio 8:7 where the horizontal res is 1080

but never mind
you never gonna understand it